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TPS Wiring Trickery


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#21 Dundaberg

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 10:54 PM

Now that's one big tin of holey shit you've just opened Reuben. Now I guess i need to hurry up and build my motor so I can put this theory to the test. I'm sure that this will work. May just take a few beers and a little head scratching to get it all sorted lol
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#22 Reuben

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 10:57 PM

Well, gotta make sure we're loaded with as much info as possible first. My only two worries are, will reversing the polarity of the 3-wire actually work, and will there be enough adjustment to get that 0.4v shift in the sensor output required to make the 4-plug ECU happy. And if not, can we mod the sensor to get more adjustment out of it?

Otherwise it looks pretty straight forward, no more wiring than what's required to do a coil pack mod for example.

Kamineko has done this mode before, putting the 20K manifold on a 20G, to run the larger intercooler. I've asked him to read over this thread to see if we're going down the right track.
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<Shale>: Blighter doesn't really have an accelerator pedal, it's more just a loudness pedal. You can change volume, but you won't go any faster.


<mjlqtown>: (Southern US accent) I'v excised the demon! This car is now clear!


<Reuben>: I feel like when you stomp the throttle in Blighter, it's like you've startled an old man!

#23 Dundaberg

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 11:01 PM

Well, gotta make sure we're loaded with as much info as possible first. My only two worries are, will reversing the polarity of the 3-wire actually work, and will there be enough adjustment to get that 0.4v shift in the sensor output required to make the 4-plug ECU happy. And if not, can we mod the sensor to get more adjustment out of it?

Otherwise it looks pretty straight forward, no more wiring than what's required to do a coil pack mod for example.


Info is key, now I really wish I had a motor in my RS to actually try this and get it to work. Unless someone else is wanting to do this and let us know how they get on cause I'd love to see this plan turn out!
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#24 Reuben

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 11:07 PM

I will be doing this next week, only thing left to do for me is to make a new loom for the manifold, should only take an evening, then plop the engine in and see what voltages I get.

You will need to make a new loom too. You basically have to make a hybrid of the origninal 20G engine loom, and the 20R engine loom. You need to use the main plugs off the old loom, but reposition the two coolant temp plugs, to suit the 20R crossover pipe, need to change the coil pack plugs, change the TPS wiring, and route it differently. pretty simple stuff really though.
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<Shale>: Blighter doesn't really have an accelerator pedal, it's more just a loudness pedal. You can change volume, but you won't go any faster.


<mjlqtown>: (Southern US accent) I'v excised the demon! This car is now clear!


<Reuben>: I feel like when you stomp the throttle in Blighter, it's like you've startled an old man!

#25 DacerX

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 11:25 PM

I want to do this, but i hate electical. Ill wait for reuben to come and do it for me :P
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#26 Dundaberg

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Posted 11 April 2014 - 12:29 AM

Oh yea sweet, i might start doing this soon too. Itl give me somthing to do while i wait for parts for my new motor
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#27 kamineko

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Posted 13 April 2014 - 10:23 AM

its simpler than you expect.

4pin TPS: 0 - 5V input. 0.9V - 4.7V output over ~90degrees of TPS shaft rotation (3.8V total swing +/- ?)
3pin TPS: 0 - 5V input. 0.5V - 4.3V output over ~90degrees of TPS shaft rotation (3.8V total swing +/- 0.3V)

both TPS: 0 - 5V input. 0.0V - 5.0V output over max degree of TPS shaft rotation

the output is linear, relative to shaft rotation. so you can invert the supply voltage as required by the newer throttlebody being rotated.

you simply need to set the TPS at throttle-off to the 4plug required voltage of 0.9V. full throttle will see the 4.7V

you will have to come up with your own solution for the idle switch. I've seen someone mount a microswitch externally on the throttlebody, set by bending the bracket

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What confuses me is that D1 appears to be a common ground for the TPS, Idle Switch, and TPS sensor shielding wire. So I don't know HOW it works, I just know the idle switch is a switch between C6 and D1.


D1 is the common ground for the TPS and the switch. (and shield via D7)
-> is the 5V supply for the TPS
<- is the TPS output
C5 is the ecu input for the idle switch. the 5V and resistor symbol is a technical note implying the input is held HIGH by the ECU until grounded by the closed switch. welcome to digital electronics.


Kamineko has done this mode before, putting the 20K manifold on a 20G, to run the larger intercooler. I've asked him to read over this thread to see if we're going down the right track.


i inverted the Version2 4pin TPS on the V3 throttlebody there. same outcome, but the idle switch was retained.

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#28 boostin

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Posted 13 April 2014 - 10:47 PM

Yup and I've done the same before my complete swap to a V3 harness and ECU.
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#29 Reuben

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 7:59 AM

HOKAY. So, i found a neat way to do the idle switch. Turns out the brake switch thing that I thought the accel pedals had was actually on the clutch, the accel pedal doesn't have provisions for any type of switch...

Unless you're a VZ-R, in which case, they have this neat little switch!

VZ-R left, normal right.
13895934011_1430ef3f01_o.jpg

Close up of the VZ-R pedal
13919047085_fa31ac50fb_o.jpg


If you take a close look at the switch, and google its part numeber: D2MV-01L2-1C3, you get this data sheet:
http://www.mouser.co...-d2mv-20403.pdf

It's a really cool switch, you can chose if you want it normally open type, or normally closed type, just simply chosing which terminal on the arse of it you use! Mean, so regardless of how it's set up, we have the ability to make it the correct type of switch to work with the ECU as an idle switch. CHUR.



As for wiring the TPS, simple work, for those who will be using a modern manifold on a 20G, with the BC/BF's factory loom, we will be wanting to keep the factory 20G engine loom, and transfering the EJ20R/H/K plugs over to it. the two plugs needed are the coil pack plug, if using a 20K style, and the the TPS plug. Some other wires need to be extented, like the idle controller, refer to what I did with this post on Blighters build thread: http://www.dirtyolbc...dpost__p__60832

The red wire in the loom needs to be wired to the green wire on the plug
The black wire in the loom needs to be wired to the red wire on the plug (so this is how we reverse polarity)
The white wire on the loom needs to be wired to the white wire on the plug. This is the signal wire to the ECU.
The brown wire on the loom is disregarded. We will find that wire at the ECU, and send it to the accel pedal instead.

At the accel pedal, it doesn't matter what pins you use, wire the brown wire from the ECU, the pin is C6 at the ECU. Simply send the wire down to the blue plug on the accel pedal, pick a pin, and crimp a connecter on. The other pin, you just wire into a local ground, and you're done. If you want to be proper, this ground is D6 on the ECU normally.

I'll post up a pic of the ECU plugs soon.


Posted Image


<Shale>: Blighter doesn't really have an accelerator pedal, it's more just a loudness pedal. You can change volume, but you won't go any faster.


<mjlqtown>: (Southern US accent) I'v excised the demon! This car is now clear!


<Reuben>: I feel like when you stomp the throttle in Blighter, it's like you've startled an old man!

#30 ANOTHERWHITESUBARU

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Posted 05 July 2014 - 5:26 AM

so what does the switch on the pedal do from factory? i have a v1 ra that im rewiring. on that note does anyone have wiring diagrams for my car? im putting in a link and racetech dash but still would be nice to have diagrams

#31 nztintin

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Posted 05 July 2014 - 5:39 AM

that switch is a super common part in hundreds of things, i would change a couple of those switches a week at work. if you need to replace one get an omron one, they are the best quality and not that much more expensive than the "cheap" ones

#32 ANOTHERWHITESUBARU

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Posted 05 July 2014 - 10:28 AM

oh yea common switch seen them on all kinds of things, but does anyone know what the function of the switch is?

#33 Reuben

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Posted 06 July 2014 - 10:15 PM

No idea, this one came of a BF VZ-R, but I've since spotted that setup on mitches BF5D gt. it's not in any wiring diagram I've seen either, and is independant of the actual idle switch in the tps. I figured it had something to do with the VZ-R's variable intake geometry, maybe the GT had its pedal box replaced?
Posted Image


<Shale>: Blighter doesn't really have an accelerator pedal, it's more just a loudness pedal. You can change volume, but you won't go any faster.


<mjlqtown>: (Southern US accent) I'v excised the demon! This car is now clear!


<Reuben>: I feel like when you stomp the throttle in Blighter, it's like you've startled an old man!

#34 DCVR

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Posted 17 June 2018 - 5:01 AM

so for those wanting to do the 4 wire TPS to 3 wires TPS conversion here is the diagram

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#35 Reuben

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Posted 03 July 2018 - 12:47 PM

‘Brown not used’ there for reference is the idle switch.
Posted Image


<Shale>: Blighter doesn't really have an accelerator pedal, it's more just a loudness pedal. You can change volume, but you won't go any faster.


<mjlqtown>: (Southern US accent) I'v excised the demon! This car is now clear!


<Reuben>: I feel like when you stomp the throttle in Blighter, it's like you've startled an old man!

#36 THE UNDERTAKER

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Posted 26 September 2018 - 5:57 PM

So does this mod only work correctly on A/M ecu? Or is rebens switch on the throttle pedal the way around it. Tried it on my bf(factory ecu). After about 20-30kms car goes into limp mode wont rev past 2000 rpm unless unplug Tps plug. Thanks

#37 Dundaberg

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Posted 26 September 2018 - 7:49 PM

Workes in my factory ecu for years. So I guess the pedal switch is the key
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#38 Reuben

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Posted 25 October 2018 - 6:50 PM

2000 rpm limp mode for idle switch? That seems a bit extreme... did it only bring up idle switch with the codes, or was it TPS code. Did you calibrate the sensor? It needs to be rotated 10-20deg off the angle at which they sit on the BG’s, that much is covered above, you have to provbe your voltages at closed and open to make sure it’s setup for a first gen.
Posted Image


<Shale>: Blighter doesn't really have an accelerator pedal, it's more just a loudness pedal. You can change volume, but you won't go any faster.


<mjlqtown>: (Southern US accent) I'v excised the demon! This car is now clear!


<Reuben>: I feel like when you stomp the throttle in Blighter, it's like you've startled an old man!




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